Make An Extra 30k with Jenna Soard

Make An Extra 30k with Jenna Soard

Jenna Soard is a branding and design expert. She has empowered numerous entrepreneurs with her brilliant courses. On this episode, she offers insight into creating an extra $30,000 quickly.

Table of Contents

Jenna's Background

Jenna Soard Online Course
Jenna Soard | Source: Instagram

Mike: Can you give us just your background? You have this background in branding, and then you got into launching courses. Just give us a real quick professional background, and then I do want to hear about that ceiling that you hit, and then what it's been like.

Jenna: So little background about me. I was a childhood entrepreneur, started my first business when I was 16. I was slinging custom tee shirts to all the sports teams in my high school. I made so much money when I was 16, I bought myself a brand new car, and I was like "Being an entrepreneur's awesome." And that was the first day that I became unemployable.

It took me a second to figure out what I wanted to do. But I eventually got an undergrad in multimedia design, and an MBA in marketing. And the second I got my MBA is when I started to combine my love of design with communicating with target markets. That was the thing that made me stick out amongst all other newbie designers, was that I could take something visual and communicate with a target market more effectively.

So here I became this branding design wizard, and I had all these clients. But then, I actually realized that I didn't want to do client work anymore, because it was burning me out. And so I moved to Tokyo for a year and was teaching at a university. And I was teaching a thousand students a week in person how to do like speech and debate and all these things. And I fell in love with teaching and I was like, I have to find a way to merge my love of graphic design with teaching. So I launched a school back in 2013 on teaching non-designers how to design, and it was wildly successful and it was very, very fun.

Creating beautiful websites with shit products

Jenna: But the problem was, was that people were creating beautiful websites with completely shit products. And so I couldn't ethically continue on teaching design to people who shouldn't have been creating websites to begin with. So the moral to take away with this is that, if you have a winning idea that serves a need in the marketplace, it actually doesn't really matter what your brand looks like. The branding part can come later. You need to find the idea that's actually going to sell. And so I stopped teaching design to start focusing on helping people create offers that actually sell, so that they could start making money before they even invested in any brand photography or anything. So that's what I do now.

During this time, I decided to go work for… Right at the time I was starting my first course, I decided to go work for Nike, and I was a senior graphic designer for Nike for a year. And the whole reason why I went to go work for them was to steal their ideas on how to have a profitable brand.

So I went in like a corporate espionage style. Sorry to Nike if you're listening. And I monitored everything that they did to create really profitable brands. And what they were experts at was communicating to ideal clients in a way that made products feel like they were made for them. And that was such a great learning lesson for me, because how many times have we tried to create a product that we would want to create versus a product that somebody's requesting that we create.

Are you using the words that they would use? Are you creating the thing that they would actually say like… It cracks me up when people are like, "I'm going to create a course about how to become best friends with my boss." Somebody did this, and I was like, okay, who wakes up in the morning and actually says those words The words that they might actually say are, "I want to quit my job," or "I have a dream I want to actually achieve," "I have a goal I actually want to achieve." They don't wake up and think, "I want to be best friends with my boss." We can have these crazy notions about what actually people want. And I have this saying, and you guys can quote me on it, that "Guessing is expensive."

Find The Problem That You're Really Wanting To Change

Jenna: It is really expensive. So all you have to do to figure out what people actually want it is, you need to think about what it is you're trying to change in the world. What is the problem that you see out there that you're really wanting to change. And for many of you guys, I'm sure it's around weight loss or helping people become healthier versions of themselves. But if you start to look at the marketplace, you can see where the holes are based on the problems that your clients are complaining about all the time And as you start to think about what you want that transformation to look like, what you can do is start to gather, let's say five or 10 of those people that are suffering from that problem that you want to help them solve.

Maybe you figure out that you have a special technique for helping people lose more than a hundred pounds. That's a little bit different than trying to help somebody become a strong lifting coach or something. There's different things that we have that we're trying to achieve So if you were trying to create a program, and your desire is really to help people who are trying to lose a hundred pounds or more, that's a very different target than somebody who's trying to lose some vanity weight.

Mike: Yeah. So I'll throw a situation at you.

Jenna: Okay, yeah.

Mike: So we have a lot of clients, we have a lot of people that come through that are like… They, themselves, have moved beyond the surface-level status, motivation. They've become intrinsically motivated. They've hit a level of actualization and this one area of their life which is like, "Oh no, it's about holistic health. It's about meditation and breath and movement." And, "Whether you have abs or not doesn't really matter." And so now they want to sell, "I'm this holistic health expert," and dah, dah, dah. And then all of a sudden the leads dry up or this is new for them. And it's like, wow.

And then I advise them like, let's find a niche that is weight loss or putting on muscle, or solving an actual problem for somebody, and getting that person who's been through this… You have coaches that go through a weight loss transformation and it's easy for them to coach weight loss. But then when they go into the next, because this is predictable stages of development for a coach, is they're going to go through another transformation themselves where they realize, "Oh, a lot of that stuff didn't really matter." So now they're trying to sell something they just learned versus meeting the clients where they are.

Your business should not be your entertainment

Jenna: And you know what we call this? Using your business as a way to entertain yourself. Your business is not meant to be your entertainment. Let's just first put that out there. That you're here to serve clients where they're at. And sometimes that means just taking what you're currently doing to the next level. But then that still answers the question, or still begs to answer the question, what does it mean to create something that has what we call a unique mechanism? Have you ever heard of this before? Ever heard the term unique mechanism?

Mike: No. I've never heard that one. No.

Jenna: So there's $1,000 book called, it's Eugene Schwartz's, Breakthrough Advertising, one of the most famous marketing books that you could ever get in the world. If you tried to purchase it now, it's out of print. So quick little secret hack. If you do a search for Breakthrough Advertising, Eugene Schwartz on Google, even though it's $1,000 book, you can totally get a PDF of it on Google.

So market sophistication. This is just going to help you understand how markets work, so that you can see why maybe competing has been a little bit tough. So some people try to get super creative and they're like, "I'm going to create something that the world's never seen before." And that's cool, because when you do that, you're an innovator, you're a pioneer, which is cool because you have no competition. But the problem is when you try to create something too unique and innovative, the market is too small.

It can appear to be exciting because there's no competition. But here's the problem with trying to be super fancy in what you're trying to do. You have to spend millions of dollars of educating people on why they should trust this idea.

Being The Pioneer Doesn't Always Pay Off

Jenna: I'll give you a perfect example of a company who did this brilliantly, and you can see how they dominated the market in this time. Uber, when they came out on the marketplace, nobody knew that you could download an app and have a stranger come pick you up. So can you imagine how much they had to spend to educate people that this was a good idea?

Mike: And being the pioneer doesn't always pay So Lyft came in behind Uber, and they raked it in. Uber is more popular. It's part of the common vernacular now. However, Uber also took all the legal arrows. They spent hundreds of millions, if not more, on all the legal aspects of fighting to get them into different cities. So even if they did make more money, I bet Lyft kept more money.

This is also something to look for, that if you find an innovative idea that there's not a lot of competition, and you can actually be learning a lot from people who are in that marketplace. The benefit here is that the competition is small. But the downside is that it's expensive to educate them on why they need it. And so that's the big reason to not come in at this level.

Then when you go up to the next level, so think about Uber. The second that Lyft came in on the scene and it was starting to become more popular, now, people were looking at, "Oh, do I do Lyft or do I do Uber? How do I make that decision?" Mike, how would generally people make that decision based on Uber or Lyft? What would be the things that they would consider?

Mike: The two things that I've seen people consider is price and, well, three. Price and then quality. My perception was that Uber had a higher standard for cars and drivers and all that kind of stuff. You needed a newer car. So price, quality, and then also, the drivers were saying, because you would see the drivers would have both stickers in the car and then you'd get in, they'd talk shit about one or the other.

Creating a special sauce for you to stick out in the marketplace

Jenna: So how many people here can relate to this idea of trying to compete on price, quality, speed "We're faster," "We're quicker," "We're better," "We're more convenient," "We now have online classes." Cool. But that's not really going to be the thing that's going to make you really be able to be pure-less, basically. You want to get to a point where you have a competitive advantage that your competitors are trying to catch up to the innovative stuff that you're doing.

You want to take your current idea that's working, that there's an active market seeking a solution to. That's the most important part. And that you end up creating a secret special sauce that is going to make you stick out in a market. So if you think about Lyft or Uber, they start to become a little bit of a commodity. Everybody has a favorite, but in reality they're really doing the same thing. And that's why there's drivers who are working for both. They're really not that different. If we look at a company like Peloton, for example. What did Peloton do that was different than Nordic Track, for example? They had what, live classes.

Peloton created massive market share, brand awareness, all the things, because of the special secret sauce. And now Nordic Track, they also have classes, but they're in exotic locations. So now they're in what we call an arms race, which we're going to talk about here in just a second. But as you can see here, the sweet spot that you're looking for is creating a unique method that eliminates all other for is creating a unique method that eliminates all other competitors.

When you think about your own business, I want you to think about what is the need in the marketplace that needs to be served that you can do differently than what you've seen out there.

And so this actually happened in my own business. Here I was teaching branding and design and all these people were creating these really awesome websites and their products sucked. So I was like, I need to create a course to teach people how to create their very own product that they can put on this website and be able to sell it in a way that's going to be different than how it's taught any place else.

So what happened was I ended up creating a method called The Beta Launch Method where I teach a beta testing method that is different than the world has ever seen. Nobody has been able to catch up to this yet. I don't know why. I think it's because every time I tell people about it I'm like, "If you try to copy me, I will sue you."

I've actually had to do and I really protect the method because it's something that I created. But you hear when people want to bring their programs online, they often do things what we call pre-selling. Have you ever heard of the term pre-selling before?

Why Pre-selling Is a Terrible Idea

Jenna: Okay. So can you think of any ideas of why pre-selling is kind of a terrible idea?

Mike: Oh, a terrible idea. I was thinking about why it's a great idea.

Jenna: I know. Well, so there you have the experience an the philosophy that that's a great idea because the idea that you're probably thinking of is if I pre-sell this, then I can verify if people actually want it before I create it

There's a massive problem with this and this is what I discovered and it became the entire foundation for what I teach is that my philosophy is, is that if you create a beta test and you actually do it for free and you get 500 to a thousand people in to take your 500 or a thousand dollars course. If you can't get people to sign up for free, your idea sucks.

So the idea here is that you're sticking in the sweet spot of taking things that people actually know about and that you're turning around and you're adding a special sauce. What are you doing that is going to be serving a need in the marketplace better than anybody out there?

And maybe it's that you create a custom coaching experience live where you get a bunch of different coaches where everybody else is doing something that's not so customized. Or there could be a number of different things. Or you could be like Mike and go beyond just teaching people how to coach, but actually how to create online businesses. That's this very special, unique niche that not a lot of people teach in.

So think about the opportunity that expands when you actually find a way to create an online course or membership.

Why Go With Online Courses Or Memberships

Jenna: So one of the other things is that you create an online course or a membership means no more overwhelm or panic about having to create one-on-one clients. If you're one of those trainers that is really working with one-on-one clients and that's been your whole entire method of operation, well guess what? You only have so much time in the day and you only have so many slots. So even if you were doing stuff in person and you had a pretty successful business, there was a certain amount of ceiling that's been capped on you by doing that.

And so how do we turn around and actually turn this into something where you can multiply yourself? So you want something that you can scale and you can take on thousands of clients instead of a few.

Giving them online coaching where you just have to hire more and more online coaches to support them through your A to Z system means that you can actually take something proprietary and turn it into something that people will pay for and you can still find a way to scale by hiring extra coaches to support them in that system.

Mike: What do you tell the coach who they hear this, they like, "Oh, I know that if I serve more people then the quality's going to go down."

Jenna: Yeah. Not if your mode of operation is to hire coaches that are going to support them so they can't fail. Of course you can do the DIY version of something where you charge less money, there's less support, there's less people to hire, and yeah, there are going to be people who will get less results with that likely.

But then you can start to brainstorm. What are the higher level services where they get a coach, they get a one-on-one coach or they get a small group coaching coach or they get you coming on every day for a certain period of time to help the masses get through it all together. It's usually one part of a live component and one part of a custom solution that means that you can charge more and keep the quality high. If you want to go for the masses, you can do a lower level challenge or membership or something where they're paying that. But it's the difference between having to find a thousand customers to make the same amount of money that you could with a hundred customers.

Higher Ticketed Programs Sell More

So that's kind of what we're looking at here and neither is wrong. It just depends on what your goal is. And actually what I've discovered from having my own lower level membership and higher ticketed programs, that I actually sell high ticketed programs more easily than I do selling a lower level thing. Because people who are willing to invest in themselves can see what I'm trying to do. Whereas lower level people sometimes can be suffering from scarcity mindset issues.

Mike: I enjoy those clients more. People who spend more money, it's easy for me to engage with them. And they're actually taking action. I always think the level of their investment is going to dictate the level of their commitment

Jenna: It should make them feel a little uncomfortable. Who's going to be willing to do the work? The person who spends $8,000 on a fitness coaching package with you or the person who spends $10 a month.

We do things that we invest in. You want to be solving a problem which is going to create an impact in the world and that impact is how you become known. So start to think about what is the impact that you want to make. And maybe there's something special that you're doing with keto or carnivore or ballet or … Like what is the thing that you're going to do that's going to get people a drastic result in a creative way? And that's where you can start to think about that unique mechanism.

Don't Sell It as A Free Program

Mike: I'm going to challenge you real quick. So my issue with free stuff that I've noticed in the past is people's level of commitment's really low. So their ability to actually complete a program is not that good.

Jenna: Here's the difference. You don't sell it as a free program. You sell it as them becoming a beta tester that they can only get access to it if they participate. And not everybody's accepted. So they have to apply and they're getting a scholarship basically to come in. And so if they don't participate, they get kicked out and they're not getting this program that they can have collect dust on their hard drive. So this is very different than a free program.

So they use it or lose it and they know it's going to be … After this, if you want this, it's going to be $1,000, $5,000, whatever it is.

Yeah. It's a limited-time experience in exchange for feedback and testimonials. This is your time to get feedback on the process to see if it gets people results, that they're getting a scholarship to do this and they get their ass booted if they don't do it.

People with established audience don't need this

Mike: When I launched Strong Coach, I did a beta to launch it, but it was just at a highly discounted rate. But I still did charge something.

Jenna: When you have an established audience like you do, you don't need to do this. Your audience would freaking love this. Like if you're like, "I'm doing a thousand dollars program and I'm taking 500 people to come through and test it," they would be like arm ruffling to get into it. There would be some competition of who got in, who didn't get in.

A perfect example of when you have a creative and unique method that is the antithesis of what you believed, how now you're listening because you're like, "Okay, this is something different." Putting it in action.

So I've had 24,893 students come through my courses, hit 1 million revenue in five years, teach a different approach to online courses than you likely have seen before. So here's what generally happens with online courses. They don't do primary and secondary research. They don't actually interview people. And primary research means that you have to interview people who are suffering from the problem that your course will solve

So if you're looking to help somebody lose a hundred pounds, you're going to interview people who are a hundred pounds heavy and not the people who are trying to lose five. So you're creating a niche for yourself by deciding you want to do that. If you're teaching people how to lose weight by using ballet moves, you're going to find people who are into that to interview them, not just any random person.

Secondary is you need to see what other industry leaders are out there doing and create a competitive advantage that sticks out. When you created Strong Coach or whatever programs you were, maybe there wasn't a lot of other stuff out there, but if there was something out there, you could go review what they were doing and create something that was way better to get yourself to stick out.

The right amount of information in a course

Jenna:So moving forward, how do we figure out what is the right amount of information to put in a course? Well, the info that's needed and the length of the course, that's the best is long enough to deliver on the promise of the course. No more, no less. If it's to help somebody make their first thousand dollars with their coaching business, then that should be the theme of the course.

How to create your first thousand dollars, and then you can create these very digestible, very transformative, delivers on the promise, gets people results super fast where they don't get overwhelmed. And then you might be thinking, "Jenna, I want to do more than help people make their first thousand. I want to help them make their first a hundred thousand." So maybe the mini course is how to create your first thousand and that's what you're beta testing, and how to make your first hundred thousand is what you're selling them into as a three month or a six month or a 12 month coaching package, so that you can kind of beta test something short to create transformation.

And then, whatever you offer them can be actually a series of mini courses that take them through transformation. If you try to dump everything in one course, oftentimes people get overwhelmed and they won't finish it and you won't get the same result than if you actually create a schedule with a very, very quick digestible courses.

Why Other Course Creator Fail

Jenna: The first beta test I ever did for my design program had hour long videos for 14 days straight and I gave them no breaks. They were like, "Why are you doing this to us?" They were really upset. The second that I changed the course ended doing 10 to 15 minute videos were watched a little bit, do a little bit, watch a little bit, do a little bit, the small little wins that they were getting were propelling them to go to the next one. And I wasn't requiring them to sit and memorize all the content that's in a video that they could actually reference back to this as sort of a standard operating procedure, which was super helpful.

When you guys are doing your own courses and you're teaching people about nutrition and you're teaching them about exercises, don't mix all that in one video. Make it bite size so they can go back and reference how to set up the refrigerator or, that they can reference what are the basic stretches that they need to do and not have it be a part of all these things. However you're going to set that up.

The other thing that happens oftentimes when people run into issues with putting together a course is that they kind of get confused on how to put it all together with the length of the videos, the PDFs, and how to actually put it into an online school. What you need actually is sort of a step by step roadmap that takes the guesswork out of that. It usually comes in the form of creating a course like a Lego manual.

Most people, if they follow a Lego manual, whether they're five or whether they're 80, they're going to get the same result. And what I discovered about courses is the more that you're teaching about theory and you're giving them a bunch of decisions and you're giving them 9 million examples of different software they can use, analysis paralysis happens when people have too many decisions to make.

What I tell people when they do my courses is I'm like, "I'm going to give you one technology. I recommend that you try it my way first. If you want to innovate afterwards, cool. But you have to do it my way first." And what happens is it gets them out of their own way, thinking that they have to do things a certain way.

The other reason why course creators fail is that they do the pre-selling thing and they don't create a course for a hundred to a thousand beta testers before they sell it. And so a hundred to a thousand technically beta testers are needed to give you feedback and testimonials and fail and pivot with when you only sell it to 20 people, you run into a massive problem with not getting enough data.

Because how many times have you sold a program to somebody at a reduced price and they are now associating the value of that price reduction with the value of the course? You might have a thousand dollar course that you're selling for $250, but now they're associating the value of $250 not with a thousand. And so this is a real mind effort for yourself and for them to not have the level of commitment that they would do if it was a one or $5000 program and they're going to lose access to it if they don't participate.

Creating a student-centric course

Jenna: So this is what creates a student centric course because you're actually creating the course with them instead of actually just guessing and throwing a bunch of stuff in there and having five or 10 people go through it that you're actually getting the feedback of where people are dropping off at, and if they're stopping watching the videos because they're too long or they don't understand something, you're going to be able to identify where those things are happening so that you can actually fail and pivot with them. On top of that, let's say you start teaching the course and you decide you hate it, if you've collected presale funds from them you're going to feel obligated to take them through the entire thing.

If you go through this and you're like, "You know what, I actually really don't like teaching this and I actually don't really want to continue making videos for it," you can hit the eject button and start over again. It's totally fine to do that and it actually happens a lot with people where they'll pick a target market that they think that they want to work with and they turn around and find out it's not who they want to work with at all.

I had somebody who came through and did a course specifically for mom entrepreneurs and she went through one week of the beta test and she goes, "I don't want to work with mom entrepreneurs. They're too into their kids. I just want to work with regular entrepreneurs," and she could completely trash the entire thing without having to spend a million hours and taking people's money.

Know how to sell your course

Jenna: The other thing is that people fail because they don't know how to sell their course, they don't know how to bridge that gap between where the consumer is and where they want to actually go. Selling your beta testers after you've already delivered thousands of dollars of value to them is a super easy sell because they're like, "Oh my God, This person, they really get me. I had a really hard time losing any weight and just me being a beta tester, I've lost 10 pounds and now I'm ready to lose the additional 90 with this person because they gave me a transformation."

That'really hard to do in a webinar and that's really hard to do with the commitment of somebody who joins a challenge. They may or may not be committed to that challenge, whereas here they're actually a committed participant. And so that's why I created a process that's consistently enabled my students to have figure launches even when they don't have a list because you use the beta test as a way to actually inspire them to get into it. So that's when I created the beta launch method and I created processes different than anything else out there. Back when I did this in 2013, I had a very small email list and generated $33,000 in sales very easily because I showed them what was possible and then it was an easy investment for them.

Gather Data with Your Potential Clients

Jenna: It starts off with actually surveying and interviewing people that suffer from the problem that your course will solve and using Typeform or SurveyMonkey to do that. Some of the most important questions that you can ask them is something like, "If you could change one thing about trying to lose a hundred pounds, what would it be?" or "If you could change one thing about X, what would it be?" Because oftentimes people will have a problem admitting that they're struggling, but they won't have a problem admitting about the one thing that's getting in the way.

Yeah. If you could change one thing about X, what would it be? You also can use these survey respondents as beta test applicants. You actually turn the survey into an application for your beta, so you're surveying them at the same time that you're getting them in.

And you might be thinking, "Well, how do I create the course? If I'm doing the survey first and it's an application and I'm doing all the things," but what you're doing is you're just coming up with a general idea of what the beta test is going to do for them, and then you're going to modify what you actually put in the course based on what the applicants put on the survey also. The survey serves as a way for you to help create content for the course, but it's also the application for them to actually get into the beta test.

The concept of Lead ads

Jenna: If you're thinking to yourself, "Well, I don't know who I would send out the survey to because I don't have anybody on my email list." Well, one of the things I do in my program is I teach people how to do these very easy things called lead ads. Lead ads are a Facebook ad that's different from any other Facebook ad out there. They don't require a landing page.

The landing page is built into the ad. When you see the ad, it pops open a landing page where it actually asks the person questions and it automatically inputs their name and their email address and even their phone number. You can actually get leads to come in and be beta testers that are way cheaper than doing normal Facebook ads. And actually right now with everything that's going on, these leads are the cheapest

The more questions that you ask on this, the higher quality the lead, the less questions you ask on this, the cheaper the price and the lower quality the lead. So you can think about… Sometimes when people put 10 questions on here, their leads are 10 bucks, but you can imagine that those people are pretty qualified.

Sometimes what I do is when somebody who's got kind of a new business idea and they really don't know if it's going to work or not, I'll have them ask way less questions so that they can actually practice on shit leads before they actually invest in getting people to come in. So they can get their 500 people in at 50 cents a person and then only cost them $250 to have 500 people do this.

Next Phase: Creating A Course Based On The Gathered Data

Jenna: Creating a course based on outlines from those surveys is what we do in the next phase of this. You have all these answers coming in from Typeform or SurveyMonkey, and then you also have the leads coming in from ads, so you have organic people coming in by you sending out a survey to your email list or to people on your Facebook and your Instagram page, and they use ads to actually use this as a list building thing. Most people think I need to build my email list first and then sell to people.

What I'm actually saying is that the launching process of you creating this course is the list building activity. So even if the people don't buy this time, it doesn't mean that they're not going to buy the next time you sell something. I've monitored leads that sometimes leads don't buy for a year or they don't buy for six months.

As you do this process and you bring beta testers in, even if they don't buy at the end of the beta test, they might buy from you the next time that you sell something, which is awesome. So you use this as a lead generating thing. The big promise here for this is that the courses that we see do the best are the achieve X and X days with your special method. And you have to be super, super, super… It's kind of funny because this is old.

So if you were competing on the level of doing easier, faster, more enjoyable, more effective, we'd actually replace that with whatever your unique mechanism is. The unique mechanism is something that I discovered in the past month. So I was making the same mistake of being like, "Yeah, just like computer and the things that everybody does," but we now know that you would be achieve X and X days with whatever your acai berry or your collagen or I'm going to help you lose a hundred pounds by doing carnivore or whatever that unique mechanism is.

Let's say that that's the method of all the milestones that they need to hit first. You take each milestone and brainstorm each step to get to that milestone. So now you can see here each of the milestones are broken out with steps for each of these. These steps become your lessons. So what are the steps to get to milestone one, create a concept of a book. Maybe step number one is creating a questionnaire, step number two is researching in the industry, step number three is writing the definition or concept for the book.

And so you can see here that what is marked in yellow could be the mini course that you're beta testing with 500 to a thousand people and then selling them into the production of the rest of the course. In that way, you're actually pre-selling a little bit, right? You're giving them a taste of what's possible in one to two weeks, and then you're selling them into the rest of the course so that you're creating the rest of the course with paid beta testers.

It's different from pre-selling

Jenna: It's a little bit different than actually pre-selling. So the yellow is the mini course, the promise and the concept of the outline. So think about this here, if you were doing this, the mini course would probably be called How to Create an Outline of your Book in 14 days, and here are the milestones and the steps that it would take to achieve. Milestone number two is being or could either be concept of the book or outline of the book.

Then you sell them into getting published, so then you say, "Okay everybody, well, we've created the concept and the outline of the book now. If you would like to continue on this, I'm actually looking for paid beta testers to go into creating the rest of the course, which is How to Actually Publish a Book in 90 days before you actually write it." So then you offer them a special beta testing price to come in and take it. Let's say it's a $2000 program, you allow these beta testers to come in for $1000.

$2,000 program, you allow these beta testers to come in for $1,000 and so now they can pay 12 payments of $97 over the next year and you've now have paid beta testers to come in. So you can imagine how many more pre-sells you're going to get when you actually have delivered value over two weeks, which in this time when everybody's got so much time on their hands and they're trying to work on whatever their goal is, you can imagine that the participation in this is going to allow the conversions to be a lot higher.

So what we see is that we see the conversions end up being about anywhere from five to 15% versus the normal one to 3% with a regular launch. And so that gives you the seed money to then turn around and use that money for things like webinars and challenges where the cost per lead is a lot more expensive.

Where to find beta testers

Jenna: Yeah, I mean you can find beta testers at Facebook groups. You can ask someone who'll be your ideal customer if they want to come in and take the course. You can send a survey or application to your email list or your social media following. You can have someone you know promote the beta for you.

So like if I was doing a beta test right now on how to launch a website and I wanted to give people like a … What if I came to you Mike, and I was like, "I want to teach your people how to create a brand strategy for their business." And I said, "I'm doing a beta test. I'm going to sell this program for $1,000 eventually." Like how likely would you be wanting to promote that to your list?

You'd want to, right? Because it doesn't feel salesy. Now how would it feel if I said, "Hey Mike, I want to do a webinar where I'm going to sell to them at the end." Would you be as likely to want to do that versus it being a beta test, which is a much higher value thing.

Mike: Beta tests. And it always just comes down and it's like, "Is this going to be good for my audience?"

Jenna: Yeah, is this going to be good for my audience? Well, think about the value that you would fill yourself for if you're like, I'm giving my audience $1,000 program versus I'm going to try to sell them something where it's obvious I'm going to be making an affiliate fee. Right?

Mike: Yeah.

Jenna: The thing is that when I've had students do this and actually go find affiliates for this, we've seen crazy things happen and I think there's some examples of this in here.

Success Stories From Jenna's Students

Jenna: So Mat Shaffer, his first ever launch, he teaches people how to do dating, how to create connections and how to find the love of your life. He did Instagram ads and he also did affiliates and he ended up getting his testers for 22 cents with ads. This was an example of one of his ads seeking beta testers for a course on connection. They hit apply now and that's what actually takes them through. You can see here dollar 33 a lead, 363 leads. This would be down even cheaper right now because this was like at the height the market,

He sold it $47,000 during his beta to approximately a hundred testers. So we only have 363 from ads. He got the rest of them from affiliates. He went and did a YouTube live with somebody who said, "Yeah, go take Matt's course. It's 30 days and it's amazing." And he did a beta that was really long. He did a full on course. He does a 30 day experience with them and then he sells them into another 30 day experience. And so the takeaway here is that ads, an organic strategy can let you on fire. Matt repeated the ads, he just turned them on, got him more testers, got him more affiliates and he did 92,000 a second launch. He didn't have anybody on his list before and he didn't have a program before he did this.

So he created the program with the people and then managed bringing that in and you can imagine it what that … Can you imagine like now if you went and did a webinar and you spent $92,000 on ads, like he's going to blow up and he doesn't have to keep doing betas to do that because he has funds now.

Creating the mini course

Jenna: So you can create the mini course based on what you figure out from the surveys and then you can start to offer this to your people. And then you put this in an online course platform like Teachable or Kajabi or Podia. And then they actually have this professional experience that they get to consume the information for the beta test in this way.

As soon as you create the mini course and the instance that you saw with like the book publishing thing, that person would only have to create like six little lessons to have their mini course done. And I teach people how to do it in a really quick and dirty way so they can get their course up without falling into perfectionism. And then you launch to your 500 or a thousand testers, and so this is what's happening to some of my students.

A Beta Course On Canva

Jenna: This is Lindsey. She had five people reach out to her today about collaborating because they had heard about her doing a beta test and then she did a course on Canva and Canva retweeted her beta test. They were like, "You guys just check this out. Look for beta testers." Do you think that would've happened if she would have done a webinar or a challenge? No freaking way. Right?

So this just goes to show you the value of doing this versus pre-selling. Then social media examiner covered it because they were like, look at what this girl is doing. Right? Because you just don't see this offer happening very often. So then after one to two weeks of teaching, you then sell to the testers. And so this is what we've seen people do. This woman actually decided to not teach for two weeks. She decided to just do one training and it was like a half day workshop and so what she did was that she had 480 people signed up to watch the workshop.

She did the workshop, she made them an offer they couldn't refuse. At the end of it and made $9,400. The program was only $200 and she was like, this was somebody who thought public school employees would never pay every $200 for a course that doesn't offer continuing ed credits. So she was like absolutely shocked by this one thing that she had done. If she would have positioned it as a webinar, nobody would've showed up, but because it was a workshop where she was giving them transformation and asking for testimonials at the end, they're paying attention, you pay attention, they want to whip out their credit card.

Jenna's Experience with Training Camp For The Soul

Mike: Last thing I'll ask you is can you share your experience of training camp for The Soul? As real quick.

Jenna: I'm exactly nine minutes. I'm six years in my business and the business doing great and everything's great. However, I noticed something very interesting. I had been hitting revenue goals every single year, almost down to the dollar, is the same amount every single year. And I was like, "I really want to expand far beyond." I was feeling like something was holding me back. It was same thing in relationships. I was at a party. I was at our friend Val's party and I was dealing with a little bit of projection and I was like, "Oh God, I just don't know what to do."

Mike's just such like an open, loving, wonderful person who can tell you straight. I come to you before and said, "Hey, will you work me out, get me in the best shape of my life." And you're like, "No, you need to go take this program to find out what's getting in the way for you and then we can talk about working together." So I'd remembered-

Mike: Yeah, because that would have been the hard way. Like if I would have given you training in nutrition, that would actually not work and it would've been hard for everybody.

Jenna: Well, that's when you were trying to put a bandaid on a gaping wound. Right? Maybe it would have fixed some things in the short term, but it isn't really fixing things the long term. So I reached out to him and I was like, "Okay, I'm turning 40. And I'm turning 40 next month. When is the next training camp for The Soul?" Because I'd heard about it. I had met Anot at a couple events and he says the next one is happening in March. And it just so happened to be graduating on my 40th birthday. And I was like, "Okay, fine."

I ended up being like, I totally had this epiphany that it was time to take things to the next level. There were things getting in the way that no matter what transformational programs I was doing, that the only thing that was happening for me doing transformational programs like landmark or ALA or any of the programs I had done was that it was just increasing my awareness of what the problem was instead of actually solving the problem. And so Mike was like, "This program's amazing. You're going to be able to find out all the things that are getting in the way for you."

Making the investment

I had a trip planned to Bali and all the things with the coronavirus were happening and I was like, you know what? I'm investing the money to do this. This is a big investment for me. Even though I do 20 and $30,000 investment is still big because I wasn't expecting to do it and I was expecting to need it. And so I made the investment and I stayed home from Bali to make sure I didn't have any sort of thing getting in the way of me going. And I'm so happy that I did that because we were this close from it not happening because of the coronavirus and actually everybody-

Mike: By a week.

Jenna: No, by a matter of two days. Like when we ended on March 17th the quarantine in my town happened two days later. So I had to rush home to get on an airplane that only cost me $25 to fly home. It was so cheap. And then I went into quarantine.

But the thing that I learned from training camp for The Soul that was mind blowing was that I didn't realize that pain and emotions are stored in the body in a way that it's almost kind of like, you know how like when you see something and it makes you feel sad or frustrated or resentful and what you do instead of sitting and being with a feeling is that you find a way to not feel it. Like you find something to eat or you find something to watch or you find somebody to chat with online or you do anything that you can to not feel the feeling.

Mike: What I would do is, I'm really good or was really good at daydreaming. I could just put my mind somewhere else.

Jenna: Oh yeah. I mean anything to distract other than feeling that. What training camp for The Soul does is it allows you to figure out exactly how things came to be the way that they are. So I managed to discover that part of the reason why I was having a hard time losing weight was because my mom had her own negative perception of her own body. And I learned at the very young age between the years of zero and seven that you should hate your body. Like I just learned that straight up from her that she always was on a diet. She was always looking in the mirror about how things, and she was obsessed that if her body wasn't perfect, that she wouldn't be lovable.

And somehow between the ages of zero and seven, I adopted that as my own belief. And no matter what I tried to do to lose weight, that underlying belief and that trauma and that belief around myself hadn't been processed in a way for me to separate my mom's belief from my own. So training camp for The Soul allowed me a process to separate that being her belief and not my belief. And I was able to process it and have the tools to process anything that comes up moving forward. So if I feel lonely or sad or anything, I can just feel it, release it, and then be able to feel limitless with the amount of ceiling that is … There's no ceiling above me anymore.

Removing the fears and roadblocks

Jenna: Going through the program made me feel incredibly fearless and it removed all the blocks that I was having. So suddenly, like I flirt with anybody that I want too. I have no fear about saying or doing the wrong thing. I just do whatever I want out of joy and inspiration and it's attracted a lot higher caliber people to me and they're like, "Whoa, what is going on with you? Why are you so fun?"

It will be single handedly the most transformational thing I've ever done. And it's given me the tools to now take any other programs that I've invested in and be able to actually do them. Because you can't go do a mental transformational program when you have physical things holding you back. And I didn't realize that. I didn't know that pain and emotions were stored in the body and now I know how to yearn them and feel them and spend time with inner child and let all that stuff out. It's just so impressive that something like this even exists. And I honestly feel like nothing, no book you will read no workshop that you will do, no Tony Robins event that you'll go to will work unless you process the pain that is keeping you where you're at.

Mike: Awesome. Thank you for that testimony. I appreciate it. I know you got to go, so make sure you go to

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